TweetFollow Us on Twitter

May 92 - Why OODLs are Good for You

Why OODLs are Good for You

Jeffrey W Stulin

Jeffrey W Stulin Computer Software Consultants AppleLink: D1104

End of a Friendship?

During a recent visit to Florida, while staying with friends (a pair of authors), I had a frustrating, ninety minute, one a.m. argument about programming languages.

My friend Bob has had no formal computer education, yet he was able to create a sophisticated poker playing program written totally in HyperTalk. He proudly demonstrated the program running on his new Powerbook 170 (Yes, a 170. He is a best-selling author....)

After the demonstration we discussed Bob's plans for continuing his computer self-education. He wanted to know why he should learn another computer language. After all couldn't you program anything using HyperTalk?

I went into my usual b/s about Turing Machines, and yes you could theoretically use HyperTalk for all programming, but that HyperTalk was impractical for many problems.

"Like what?" he asked innocently.

During the next hour my blood pressure rose to 200 over 100; we wasted a tree trying to outline examples and counter examples; Bob went through half a bottle of scotch; both wives fell asleep in their comfy chairs (clearly not software ideologues); and I ranted eloquently about both practical and obscure issues in software development. But Bob just sat there shaking his head and repeating:

"Couldn't I just write a HyperTalk function to do that?"

What really annoyed me was that he was right: you can do just about anything with a HyperTalk function. At least anything that Bob could conceive of, since he has only had the HyperTalk language to express his programming thoughts.

Bob and I lacked a common vocabulary to talk about software concepts beyond his experience. Arrays, objects, structures, file management, and typed variables are a mystery to him.

End of my credibility in MADA?

This is the same problem I have in convincing those of you without significant dynamic language experience that OODLs-Object-Oriented Dynamic Languages such as Macintosh Common Lisp (MCL) and Smalltalk-are a good idea. We don't have a common vocabulary for communication.

Here is a statement that will get me into trouble. Putting aside the issue of runtime performance I claim that:

The set of interesting problems which can be reasonably explored and expressed using an object oriented dynamic language such as MCL is, while not a proper superset, much larger than the set which can be reasonably explored and expressed by a static language such as C++.

By "explored and expressed" I mean that, when faced with a problem, a programmer must first figure out how to solve it and then express the solution using a programming language.

Their ability to explore and express a large set of problems is the reason that dynamic languages have been the mainstay of Artificial Intelligence, which has tried to solve the "hardest" problems.

I can see that many of you are shaking your head in skepticism. After all, if OODLs are so good, why doesn't everybody use them? (You may also want to ask yourself why object-oriented programming didn't catch on in the 1960's when it was invented.)

The traditional answer (there are others, but this is the big one) is that their runtime performance characteristics are poor. They are slow, they use lots of memory, and they are occasionally interrupted by garbage collection. Which leads me to my second claim:

Advances in hardware and compiler technology will soon overcome the traditional runtime performance problems of OODLs.

In my yet-to-be-published third MCL article, I will note that figuring out how to squeeze performance out of MCL is not easy, but once done (or, in my case, once told how by the MCL development team), performance, as an issue, almost disappears.

Based on these claims, I draw a conclusion:

Sometime around the end of this decade, OODLs will be the mainstream tools used for developing software applications.

Don't take my word for it, I'm just some fool babbling over the link-waves. You can believe Larry Tesler, whose keynote address at the MADA conference said much the same thing. In fact, you don't even have to believe me about what Larry said; my understanding is that his speech is included on the conference CD. Watch him for yourself.

Is there Help for bob?

You may have noticed that this article is filled with philosophical hot air and is disappointingly thin on evidence, just like my argument with Bob. I admit my sins, ask forgiveness, and make a promise. If you, the MADA community, show an interest in OODLs, then I (and others) will write a series of articles exploring aspects of OODLs which will prove the claims stated here. Topics will include: What makes dynamic languages so expressive, dynamically vs. statically typed variables, automatic memory management, runtime performance of dynamic languages, etc. etc. And I will make Bob read them all.

I believe OODLs are in our professional future, that we can have a say in the direction of OODL development, and that programming with OODLs is more productive and pleasant than is programming using the current crop of static languages. That is why I am a co-founder of the new OODL/MCL SIG.

Interested? Join the OODL/MCL SIG and let me know.

 

Community Search:
MacTech Search:

Software Updates via MacUpdate

Latest Forum Discussions

See All

Six fantastic ways to spend National Vid...
As if anyone needed an excuse to play games today, I am about to give you one: it is National Video Games Day. A day for us to play games, like we no doubt do every day. Let’s not look a gift horse in the mouth. Instead, feast your eyes on this... | Read more »
Old School RuneScape players turn out in...
The sheer leap in technological advancements in our lifetime has been mind-blowing. We went from Commodore 64s to VR glasses in what feels like a heartbeat, but more importantly, the internet. It can be a dark mess, but it also brought hundreds of... | Read more »
Today's Best Mobile Game Discounts...
Every day, we pick out a curated list of the best mobile discounts on the App Store and post them here. This list won't be comprehensive, but it every game on it is recommended. Feel free to check out the coverage we did on them in the links below... | Read more »
Nintendo and The Pokémon Company's...
Unless you have been living under a rock, you know that Nintendo has been locked in an epic battle with Pocketpair, creator of the obvious Pokémon rip-off Palworld. Nintendo often resorts to legal retaliation at the drop of a hat, but it seems this... | Read more »
Apple exclusive mobile games don’t make...
If you are a gamer on phones, no doubt you have been as distressed as I am on one huge sticking point: exclusivity. For years, Xbox and PlayStation have done battle, and before this was the Sega Genesis and the Nintendo NES. On console, it makes... | Read more »
Regionally exclusive events make no sens...
Last week, over on our sister site AppSpy, I babbled excitedly about the Pokémon GO Safari Days event. You can get nine Eevees with an explorer hat per day. Or, can you? Specifically, you, reader. Do you have the time or funds to possibly fly for... | Read more »
As Jon Bellamy defends his choice to can...
Back in March, Jagex announced the appointment of a new CEO, Jon Bellamy. Mr Bellamy then decided to almost immediately paint a huge target on his back by cancelling the Runescapes Pride event. This led to widespread condemnation about his perceived... | Read more »
Marvel Contest of Champions adds two mor...
When I saw the latest two Marvel Contest of Champions characters, I scoffed. Mr Knight and Silver Samurai, thought I, they are running out of good choices. Then I realised no, I was being far too cynical. This is one of the things that games do best... | Read more »
Grass is green, and water is wet: Pokémo...
It must be a day that ends in Y, because Pokémon Trading Card Game Pocket has kicked off its Zoroark Drop Event. Here you can get a promo version of another card, and look forward to the next Wonder Pick Event and the next Mass Outbreak that will be... | Read more »
Enter the Gungeon review
It took me a minute to get around to reviewing this game for a couple of very good reasons. The first is that Enter the Gungeon's style of roguelike bullet-hell action is teetering on the edge of being straight-up malicious, which made getting... | Read more »

Price Scanner via MacPrices.net

Take $150 off every Apple 11-inch M3 iPad Air
Amazon is offering a $150 discount on 11-inch M3 WiFi iPad Airs right now. Shipping is free: – 11″ 128GB M3 WiFi iPad Air: $449, $150 off – 11″ 256GB M3 WiFi iPad Air: $549, $150 off – 11″ 512GB M3... Read more
Apple iPad minis back on sale for $100 off MS...
Amazon is offering $100 discounts (up to 20% off) on Apple’s newest 2024 WiFi iPad minis, each with free shipping. These are the lowest prices available for new minis among the Apple retailers we... Read more
Apple’s 16-inch M4 Max MacBook Pros are on sa...
Amazon has 16-inch M4 Max MacBook Pros (Silver and Black colors) on sale for up to $410 off Apple’s MSRP right now. Shipping is free. Be sure to select Amazon as the seller, rather than a third-party... Read more
Red Pocket Mobile is offering a $150 rebate o...
Red Pocket Mobile has new Apple iPhone 17’s on sale for $150 off MSRP when you switch and open up a new line of service. Red Pocket Mobile is a nationwide MVNO using all the major wireless carrier... Read more
Switch to Verizon, and get any iPhone 16 for...
With yesterday’s introduction of the new iPhone 17 models, Verizon responded by running “on us” promos across much of the iPhone 16 lineup: iPhone 16 and 16 Plus show as $0/mo for 36 months with bill... Read more
Here is a summary of the new features in Appl...
Apple’s September 2025 event introduced major updates across its most popular product lines, focusing on health, performance, and design breakthroughs. The AirPods Pro 3 now feature best-in-class... Read more
Apple’s Smartphone Lineup Could Use A Touch o...
COMMENTARY – Whatever happened to the old adage, “less is more”? Apple’s smartphone lineup. — which is due for its annual refresh either this month or next (possibly at an Apple Event on September 9... Read more
Take $50 off every 11th-generation A16 WiFi i...
Amazon has Apple’s 11th-generation A16 WiFi iPads in stock on sale for $50 off MSRP right now. Shipping is free: – 11″ 11th-generation 128GB WiFi iPads: $299 $50 off MSRP – 11″ 11th-generation 256GB... Read more
Sunday Sale: 14-inch M4 MacBook Pros for up t...
Don’t pay full price! Amazon has Apple’s 14-inch M4 MacBook Pros (Silver and Black colors) on sale for up to $220 off MSRP right now. Shipping is free. Be sure to select Amazon as the seller, rather... Read more
Mac mini with M4 Pro CPU back on sale for $12...
B&H Photo has Apple’s Mac mini with the M4 Pro CPU back on sale for $1259, $140 off MSRP. B&H offers free 1-2 day shipping to most US addresses: – Mac mini M4 Pro CPU (24GB/512GB): $1259, $... Read more

Jobs Board

All contents are Copyright 1984-2011 by Xplain Corporation. All rights reserved. Theme designed by Icreon.